Posts tagged Rand

Column on Capitalism & Socialism Rightly Understood

Capitalism & Socialism Rightly Understood

Tibor R. Machan

In a recent Op Ed for The New York Times, Professor Gar Arperovitz of the University of Maryland, who teaches political economy there, has written that “something different [from what OWS wants] has been quietly brewing in recent decades: more and more Americans are involved in co-ops, worker-owned companies and other alternatives to the traditional capitalist model. We may, in fact, be moving toward a hybrid system, something different from both traditional capitalism and socialism, without anyone even noticing.”

Well, this comment shows, among other things, a profound misunderstanding of both capitalism and socialism. In the formers system there is no prohibition of pockets of communitarian associations, kibbutzes, communes, cooperatives, and so forth. This is a point made emphatically by one of the 20th century’s foremost philosophical defenders of capitalism–or, as he put it, “capitalist acts between consenting adults”–the late professor Robert Nozick, in his famous book Anarchy, State, and Utopia (Basic Books 1973).

Nozick pointed out that in the libertarian system he presented in his book there is every chance to experiment with a great variety of human associations–he called the “utopias”–provided these do not sanction the coercion of some people by others. And since the kind of associations that “worker owned companies” are need by no stretch of the imagination involve any kind of coercion, they are entirely compatible with capitalism wherein the major element is freedom of association, not the pursuit of any particular goal (including profit).

It is odd that Professor Alperovitz would not be up front about this. Is he perhaps intent on misrepresenting the nature of a capitalist political economy, making it appear to be something it isn’t, namely, limited to promoting only certain types of human associations such as business firms? What about the thousands of churches in the semi-capitalist system of America which are on record promoting various spiritual goals? What about the Amish, the Moonies, the Roman Catholics, the Salvation Army, the Red Cross and many others, including clubs, fraternal organizations, and so forth, that have nothing to do with seeking the ends that most business enterprises seek? All these are fully compatible with the basic principles of capitalism but not so much with socialism. None of these are permitted in countries like North Korea or Cuba, let alone in the former Soviet Union which attempted to implement socialism, namely, the state ownership of the major means of production and the total abolition of the right to private property, a right that indeed facilitates the variety of ways people may freely associate with one another.

Professor Alperovitz is a teacher of political economy so he must certainly know about the point Nozick made and about how a near-capitalist society such as the United States of America and many other Western countries are hospitable to, indeed promote, the great variety of communal associations he misleadingly identifies as socialist? Why would he do this?

If Professor Alperovitz wants to defend socialism or some hybrid of true capitalism and true socialism–whatever that might be–he should do this up front. He should acknowledge that socialism involves state coercion, especially on the economic front, and capitalism doesn’t. The various non-economic human associations he misidentifies as socialist do not involve coercion, which makes them fit within a capitalist but not within a socialist political economy.

But I guess Professor Alperovitz isn’t really willing to put his money where his mouth is, to come out four square for a genuine socialist/capitalist hybrid. He is, instead, defending something no bona fide capitalist or libertarian–e.g., Milton Friedman, F. A. Hayek, Ayn Rand, Murray N. Rothbard, Ron Paul et al.–opposes. Every one of these champions of capitalism accepts that in a genuine free country there can be innumerable human groupings and these include worker owned firms and farms.

Column on Individualism Isn’t Rediculous

Individualism Isn’t Ridiculous

Tibor R. Machan*

Some critics of individualism propose an alternative social philosophy and defend it so it is then possible to compare their case to the individualist position. But more often than not what critics do is caricature individualism, suggesting that individualist believe that people are autonomous, meaning, exist all on their own with no need for anyone else. Or they claim individualism means that no one has any moral responsibilities toward anyone else. Or that everyone is basically self-sufficient or should be.

Now clearly very young people have to have the support of their parents, at least, and their intimates so as to get on in life. As they grow up the support they enjoy can gradually be made optional–some support will be rejected by them, as when they refuse to follow their parents’ religious or political guidance. Yet, how would one acquire something as important as one’s language and other skills if there were no teachers about to lend a hand?

Our obvious connections to many, many other people certainly cannot reasonably be denied; so by alleging that individualism requires one to believe in people’s radical independence the critics have their victory via distortion, without actually having to make out a better case. Moreover they leave the impression that their preferred alternative, whereby we all belong to society and owe everything to it, is the only one and is trouble free.

But the kind of individualism that sensible individualists champion isn’t some ridiculous notion that people can grow up and live as hermits. Even if in some very rare cases this were possible, it is surely not the sort of individualism that is promoted in social political philosophy (e.g., by the likes of John Locke, Murray Rothbard and Ayn Rand). Such individualism focuses on the moral and intellectual sovereignty of people; they need to make choices, and be free to do so, about how to act in much of their lives which they are normally equipped to do. And they need to be able to assess ideas propounded to them by others, make sure these are sound ones and not have them shoved down their throats as is done in more or less Draconian tyrannies.

This is the kind of individualism that’s advanced by reasonable individualists and if it is a good idea, it implies that a decent human community, a just one, needs to be so conceived that people can indeed enjoy sovereignty, that when they join others in various endeavors they do this of their own free will, voluntarily and not be treated like military conscripts (or termites or ants whose identity consists entirely of being tied to others of their species).

A very important point to keep in mind is that individualism isn’t at all the same as forswearing the company of others. What individualism implies is that everyone needs to be free to select those with whom one will associate, be this in adult family life, in friendship, in professional life, in sports and in recreation. Unlike the associations typical of a place like North Korea–and the military of many Western countries–as the individualist sees it adult human beings ought to exercise discretion when they join up with others. Some of this, of course, can misfire–e.g., when one let’s oneself be guided by irrational prejudices such as race or national background (although at times these are mere easy options for some folks, with no malice involved). Or when one chooses to join criminal gangs.

The central point is that individualism prizes more than other social philosophies the personal, private input of all those who take part in adult human associations. These must all be voluntary, in large part because they amount to vital moral decisions on everyone’s part which one would be deprived of making if one were herded into groups one hasn’t chosen to join. True, there will always be some gray areas, as when one is “pressured” by one’s peers or family to be part of some assembly of people one would ideally wish to be free of. There must be an exit option for free men and women but it may take some doing to make use of it.

As with most matters in human life, we aren’t dealing here with geometrical exactitude, just as Aristotle observed over 2500 years ago. But all in all the individualist alternative is far more accommodating of human nature and social life than are the collectivist alternatives that get a lot of support from social philosophers–communitarians, socialists, or social democrats–these days.

————–
*Machan is the author of Classical Individualism (Routledge, 1998). He teaches at Chapman University, Orange, CA. He blogs at http://szatyor2693.wordpress.com/

Interview on Argentine TV in 2001

This Interview was conducted on Argentine television, October 2001

Question: Do you have any explanation for the fact that the U.S. developed in the way it developed in the last two centuries, compared with its neighbors in Latin America – who didn’t develop that way?
Roughly speaking the answer is that the founders of the U.S. were people who had had it with monarchies “up to here” – they were opposed to top down government. They were not right in everything – they made mistakes – but their primary message was that it is not the king (government) who is the sovereign in a society – it is the individual members of the society who are sovereign. They rejected the status of the inhabitants of the society as subjects, and insisted that they were citizens who had basic rights The fact that they announced that in the Declaration of Independence – that everyone has the basic right to his or her life, liberty and pursuit of happiness and that the only function of government is to secure these rights – made the biggest difference, was the most revolutionary development of human political history. All the rest follows from there.
Even the mistakes they made, for example, about slavery or the treatment of the Native American “Indians,” could only be corrected in terms that they themselves laid down to guide the nature of social life, namely, in terms of individual human rights. It is not the family, the tribe, the clan, the ethnic group, or the nation but the individual human being who’s the most important “ingredient” in society.
All the other nations went along with that only willy-nilly, including Latin & Central American nations that were far less clear-cut in their opposition to monarchies, to top-down rule & society.

Question: What would you answer to philosophers like the guest we had program – a philosopher/professor at the University of Buenos Aires — who sustain that in general the problem with Latin America and the lack of development is excess of individualism, excess of selfishness and we should really in order to progress, to be part of the group, to consider ourselves part of a big type of animal where we are all involved with each other.
Poppycock is the American expression to that. I consider that completely wrong — way, way the “wrongest” answer you can give. It simply increases the power of some people [to reject individualism]. There is no such entity as the society. There’s no such as entity as the group. Those are all [conceptual and verbal] shortcuts to talking about people [in various associations with one another].
Whenever people bring up the community above individuals, they really mean that some individuals should have more power than other individuals. There is no escaping from that. Nobody who talks about the public interest vs the private interest really means some different interest. It’s some private interest that he prefers or that he considers more important vs other private interests.
I don’t know this gentleman who we are talking about but whenever people talk to me about how there’s too much individualism, and too much selfishness, that’s usually a code word for saying it’s some one else’s individualism, some one else’s selfishness that is to crowd out my individualism and my selfishness. In fact they have goals and I have goals and other people have goals. A proper society makes the realization of these goals peacefully possible. That’s what’s necessary.
There are corrupt versions of any kind of point of view including individualism. Individualism does not mean Robinson Crusoe on an island all by himself – self sufficient, unrelated to people. All individualists who have something to contribute to the discussion of political matters recognize that individuals flourish with other individuals, but not on just any terms. They have to be terms that respect the individual’s right to sovereignty in terms of which any individual should chose other individuals as members of the community. I ought to relate to friends, to relations, to colleagues, to neighbors, to fellow participants in the market place. It is better for me to do that, but not when they start violating my rights.

Question: But is it not the case, as some people sustain, that in general if you leave people alone in the market just in general, you have winners and losers, and there is no remedy to that. That in general some people will prevail over the other ones and will take advantage of them.
The market place is not a field of combat. It is field of peaceful, even friendly, competition. It’s not like a boxing ring; it’s more like a marathon race. Everybody moves forward and as long as people move forward, they sometimes drag other people forward. It’s not a zero sum game – it’s a mistaken view of the market. When there is freedom of competition, when there is freedom of enterprise, everybody gains.
Even egalitarians like John Rawls at Harvard, who’s the foremost political philosopher in the U.S. today, admit that in order to increase the common wealth of a country you need to allow for free competition. You need to allow that some people are going to get ahead faster in order for everyone to gain from this – gain that they make themselves for themselves. There is no reason to believe if you honestly look at it, that free people who respect one another’s rights become enemies of each other. They become friends/associates, of each other.

Question: Good. What I would like to review with you are some premises in general for philosophical talk, study by metaphysics in general. I would like to know, what’s the nature of reality for you?
The nature of reality is not “for me,” not for my thought. The nature of reality is what it is. This glass of water is a glass of water, whether you are a Hottentot, a German, a Japanese, or an American. It’s going to remain a glass of water until someone drinks it, then in which case, it will an empty glass of water.

Question: What about that sentence that says that everything is according to the way, the color that you see, and the different things?
No, partly because that mistakes awareness for influence. Awareness is awareness. As an analogy, when I grab a glass, I do not distort the glass. I simply pick it up; I adjust myself to the glass. When my mind becomes aware of the glass, it doesn’t distort the glass, it doesn’t make the glass into something else. You see, if you believe that it does, you are in very, very deep trouble because then your belief that that’s what’s going on is also intruded upon by your mind. Which leads to an infinite regress of distortions. There is no escape from it.
So even the people who propose that as we understand the world, we’re distorting it don’t believe that that insight is distorted and so they think something is objective, namely their understanding of the lack of objectivity between human beings and the world.

Question: I understand that, but what about relativism; is reality moving, always, in a process of changing, so you never can know it as it is, because there is always another approach. Knowledge should be obtained all the time. You never just reach a certain point where everything is known.
My response is that, if you have an unrealistic conception of what it is to know something – if in order to know that this is a glass of water, I have to have the final word on it – then knowledge is impossible. We are never here to eternity to get that final word. Knowledge is misconceived as the final word; it’s the best word on something. That is clearly possible. Even though I don’t know what may be discovered about this thing 10,000 years from now, I can know what has been discovered about it up to now. That is enough for me to know what it is. That’s all that knowledge means. Knowledge is not a promise for a finished product.

Question: I would like to know your definition of truth, according to what you said before.
Truth is a property of a belief, a judgment, or a sentence or a statement indicating that it accurately reflects what is in the world. If I say that you are wearing a dark suit; then this sentence is true just in case you are wearing a dark suit. If the suit is not dark, if you are not wearing a suit, or if you’re not even here, then this is not a true statement.

Question: So a lie is . . .
A lie is something very complicated. Now it’s not just a falsehood; a lie is an intentional falsehood. When someone deliberately says what is not the case, or what he believes is not the case –because by accident someone could lie and tell the truth – if he mistakenly thinks that something is the case, and he wants to deny it and it turns out the denial is true, then he lied and also told the truth.

Question: I want to know your opinion about miracles – and people feel well about it, and they feel like they are not transgressing their nature.
Well, they are wrong. They are transgressing their nature.

Question: What is your view of politicians?
Politicians are often criminals in disguise and this is a very sad thing and they have been like that from the time of Caesar’s and pharaohs up to today. There is no big mystery, really: they routinely rationalize their stealing and today, for example, call it redistribution of wealth, helping the poor children, or the orphans or those who are sick. It all a ruse; it’s all a charade, it’s quackery. The fact is that politicians have one job to do. That is to protect our rights, so that we can proceed with our lives peacefully. Then if we need to help people, we need to exercise the virtue of generosity. We need to be charitable. It is not charitable to steal from you and give to me who may need some help. That is theft, not charity.

Question: The idea behind this is: that we need education, somebody needs help; somebody needs to build new houses for the poor.
The “we” tends to disguise what is going on here. Granted, parents need to give their children an education, if they cannot give their children the proper education, they should not have children. It is malpractice for them to multiply without the facility to bring up their children in a helpful, flourishing way.

Question: Not allow poor people to have kids?
I’m not prohibiting them from having kids. I’m simply insisting when they have kids, they need to take care of them or ask for help from willing others and not rob other people who have goals – an artist has the goal to paint or write or compose, a scientist to study the universe, etc. These people’s goals are just as important as those parents who didn’t think before they had children. They do not have the right or the authority to take these other people’s resources and convert them to their goals. Not without their permission.
Politicians pretend that they do have this authority, which they don’t have. Legally they do, but that simply means they have the army behind them. In fact, morally speaking no one has the right to steal from another – even for a very good purpose, even for an excellent purpose. Suppose I am the most wonderful artist in the world, I compose the most beautiful music, but I am too poor to buy a piano and buy sheet music. I don’t have a right to go over and steal from you your resources that you might even squander or gambling away. As long as it comes from you, as long as it is something you’ve created from your assets, from your resources, you are entitled to dispose of those things as you see fit – even when you do it wrongly. I may criticize you; I may beg you to do it right, but I may not send the police out to reform you in my image.
This is the nature of civilization. Civilization means treating other human beings with attention to their reasoning capacity and abstaining from the use of force – even for very good objectives.

Question: So the only proper role of government is justice. No other role, like the one mentioned before – education, or just building houses for the poor or security.
A proper government is a like a referee at a game. There could be all kinds of things going on in the audience, on the playing field. Some of the players might need help, may need to be consoled because they lost the last round, but the referee must keep his/her integrity and uphold the rules, and not get involved in other things. There are other parts of society that take care of that – of charity, of generosity, of philanthropy, of business, or competition. The role of the government is to be the guardian of the rules of the free society. Those rules consist of defending individual rights; making sure that nobody gains some advantage through force and that all advantages are gained voluntarily, peacefully. Even if the advantages are huge; peace, justice is what the government is obligated to secure; not some other goals, which are perfectly OK for other people to strive for.

Question: You mentioned rights – to defend individual rights – don’t people have the right to have a job, for example in the country with such unemployment is 14%?
Consider for example if I had a right to have employment. That means I have a right for other people to buy my goods or services. Other people would then have to be conscripted – forced – in order to give me this job. They would have an obligation to buy things from me, to use my goods and services. They would not just have perhaps a moral responsibility but also a legally enforceable obligation. That would place them into involuntary servitude to me.

Question: So you don’t think people have a right to a job?
Of course not. Jobs are created through trade and exchange – through voluntary trade; to people’s free consent to use the services of those offer those services for sale. That what brings about jobs.

Question: Why in this society don’t we have jobs? And people are unemployed?
That’s a historical question. Very often the reason for that is that business, commerce, labor, is stymied – it’s blocked, there are protectionist measures that are introduced to protect some industry and give them an advantage over other industries. That keeps production enterprise down. Consider for example the fact that in the U.S., which is a welfare state, but a milder version of a welfare state, compared to France, Germany, or Argentina to some extent. There is a fairly open employment market. When you get hired by an employer he/she isn’t required to immediately give you life-long benefits. That means that more people enter the market with new ideas, with new projects, because they are not afraid that the moment they enter the market, they would be over-burdened with all these obligations to their employees. So there is more work, there are more jobs, there is more employment and they have an unemployment rate of around 4% compared to Germany where you start a business, you immediately have to promise your employees life-long security. That creates a depression of enterprise. People cannot afford to enter new enterprises and to risk assuming all these burdens they didn’t choose.

Question: What about income tax?
If you consider the origin of taxation, you will have an understanding why I will answer you the way I will. Taxation was at home in a feudal system where the king owned everything. Taxes were the rents the kings collected on other people working their property, on their land. It all belonged to the king; the king owned everything. So taxes were a form of payment to gain the king’s permission to work there. But once you change the idea of politics away from the sovereignty of the king to the sovereignty of the individuals in a society, taxation lost its rationale. Now taxation is anomaly – a strange thing in most western societies. Here we are basically paying someone because they won’t let us work without paying them. That’s called extortion. That’s what the Mafia does. It goes to a shop owner and says if you do not pay me something, I’ll burn down your shop. That’s like the government coming to say, if you don’t give me part of your income, I’ll not let you work.

Question: But how do you fight this?
That’s an interesting question. Ask yourself that question in another context. Suppose you were used to a government establishing a religion in a country. Now you suggest that that should no longer be the case. People will scratch their head and say, then how would you have worship in a country if a government does not establish it? Look at the U.S. – the government is explicitly prohibited from establishing a church. Do you know how much religion that there is in the U.S.? A lot. Everybody goes to church. Almost 90% of the people profess to be in God, and go to church. Religion did not die because the government does not protect it. Now, there’s the same question – how would legal services be funded in a society in which robbery or extortion by the government is prohibited. It has to be done by charging a fee for the services for the government should provide.

Question: What is the role of democracy in such a context?
You’re jumping ahead a little bit too fast. But my basic answer to the previous question is contract fees. You charge a fee for all written contracts in order to provide the legal background within which contracts can be adjudicated and protected – that requires police, courts, military, etc. If you confine a government to its proper role, then this will be sufficient to pay for it.

Question: In Argentina, the gross national product is 300 billion – and in general the government is taking a hundred billion of it. Would you consider that an excess?
Highway robbery. This is some people living off the backs of other people. There is no question in my mind about this. No matter how nice a rationalization for this, no matter how saintly you think politicians are, the fact is that they are robbing people of their lively-hood for purposes to which those people have not agreed.

Question: So if our president had the chance to look at the program right now and if you could give him some advice, what would you say?
Scale down the scope of the government. Not so much it’s size, but it’s scope. It needs to focus on protecting the rights of the citizenry – not on building roads, not on building sports arenas, not about protecting some industries against others, and regulating people – confine yourself to the honorable task that a politician truly should be loyal to – that is, defending individual rights.

Question: Shouldn’t the government impose science?
No! That is not its business – any more than it is its business to promote religion or to promote sports. That’s not the government’s business – the government is agent of force. Just like you can only use force when you defend yourself – not in accomplishing something with me. If I don’t give you the right answer, you can’t come over and hit me in the head, right? You have to plead with me for the right answer. Similarly the government should never use force except in defense against criminals or outside aggressors. Any other use is illegitimate use of its tools.

Question: Aren’t you defending the concept of government that was the concept in the 18th century?
No.

Question: There is no room for government – what is going to happen to the poor people?
First of all, there is a role for legal authorities to defend people’s rights. Within the context of having your rights effectively, properly defended by this legal authority, all kinds of charitable, philanthropic – kind, compassionate arrangements can reign. In fact, free societies are far more generous than coerced societies. You don’t see Iraq sending a lot of foreign aid to people – you see America doing so much more. There’s a great deal more scholarship and voluntary help when people are free. Because generosity and charity – in order for them to be true virtues have to be chosen – they cannot be coerced. Any form of coerced good behavior no longer is good behavior. It is simply regimented behavior. Now as far as sacrifice is concerned, it is true that I do not believe that the primary role of human beings in life is to sacrifice themselves. Notice the consequences of thinking so. Suppose you do believe that I should sacrifice myself for you – and then you believe that you should sacrifice yourself for somebody else and on and on and on. Who are the beneficiaries? So the only thing that could mean in any rational sense is that when people are in a special needy situation, in some emergency, when they have through no fault of their own, become in dire straits, when they are very much in need of some help, then we should take up pause with our attempts to flourish in life, and get ahead in life, and pay some attention to them. That’s what the virtue of generosity urges us to do. That was occasional charity – that’s what contributions to philanthropic groups – that’s why we should do that because people are in special circumstances – sometimes. But that shouldn’t be generalized into an overall ethics. That is, in Aristotle’s tradition, the greatest virtue is to think rationally – and thinking rationally will guide you to when to be courageous, when to be prudent, when to be honest, when to be moderate, when to be generous. Generosity shouldn’t be wasted on frivolous things; it should be exercised when genuine need from deserving people warrant it.

Question: So there is nothing wrong with accumulating wealth according to your views.
Nothing at all.

Question: Why do you think that a person that is accumulating wealth in our society is not seen well?
There are many reasons for that. Different people have different reasons and some people have a combination of reasons that leads them to think that way. Part of it is envy, part of it is resentment, part of it is the belief – an ancient belief – that this earth is not worth living for – that the only worthwhile lives are lives that are devoted to supernatural realm, to a spiritual existence. To some extent this is enhanced by some religions – not all religions. One of the reasons that in Christian Europe Jews were resented so much is that first they were excluded from ordinary professions, and the professions that they thought they could do – finance, banking – the Christians didn’t think they could do, so the Jews became rich and successful. Then suddenly everyone resented them, and eventually that is one of the major causes of the holocaust – this resentment toward the success of Jews whose religion did not prohibit them from striving for wealth. The only time Jesus became violent is against moneylenders. That’s a clue to the attitude toward riches – toward wealth gaining – that we’ve had in much of western society – especially other societies. When Saddam Hussein wanted to denounce the U.S. during the Gulf War, his major accusation was “you are materialistic”. But in fact what wealth seeking amounts to is seeking prosperity. Seeking success in a certain realm of one’s life. That’s not the most important thing, but that is one important thing – just like health. What are people who seek good health? After all they are healthy in this world; once their dead, health is not going to do them any good. Why don’t we resent people who go to doctors? Who seek help from medicine. . . we don’t resent them. Why don’t we resent people who seek health from nutrition? We don’t, because we generally recognize that a proper concern for one’s well being here on earth is a commendable, respectable objective. People who make wealth; they just don’t make wealth for them, they make wealth for their families, for their friends, for their organizations they believe in. For example, Bill Gates gives around hundred million dollars even billions of dollars sometimes to causes in which he believes. Just because there is a proper role for charity and generosity, it does not authorize the government to come in and play highway robber with the phony promise that they will allocate the wealth that they have stolen to the right cause.

Question: So your are not happy with the Robin Hood concept . . .
Well if you remember Robin Hood stole not from the rich but from the tax takers. He took the taxes back and returned to those from whom the taxes were taken. So Robin Hood was a good guy; he took only from those who first stole. He didn’t redistribute wealth that was honestly earned. That’s an interesting thing that is misunderstood about Robin Hood. There are many misunderstandings that people invoke to justify their criminality,

Question: Protectionism – do you think it’s a proper tool for development?
Protectionism is just a nice word for intruding on business. If I have a barbershop, and you have a barbershop, and you cut hair for a lower price than I. Am I entitled to hire some big fellow to stop at your door all the customers who go to your barbershop?

Question: Of course not.
Well then, that’s protectionism. That’s the bottom line of protectionism. Getting government with its armies, with its police – to protect some people against the competition in the marketplace.

Question: But what about the people we are protecting – our industrialists against foreigners?
There is no “our” vs “foreigners” in a marketplace. We don’t have “our vs. theirs.” It’s a form of discrimination that should be resented just as much as any sort of ethnic or sexist discrimination is. Any sort of protection should be given to individual rights – and let the rest of it play itself out, as freely combining and interacting human beings will.

Question: It is said that the U.S. develops itself thanks to protectionism.
It may very well be true to some extent. The U.S. has done that – and it was wrong for it to do so. It shouldn’t have advanced its own economic well being by barring others from competition. To the extent that it is done so, it was wrong. That’s true of all countries that practice protectionism. There is no excuse for it – it’s all a pretense; they are all farmers – they are human beings. If they honestly produce, they should be able to honestly trade.

Tibor, thank you very much for this lesson.

Interview by The Daily Bell (URL)

http://www.thedailybell.com/674/Tibor-Machan-Individualism-Minarchism.html